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	<title>Comments on: trees vs signs</title>
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	<description>Harrisonburg&#039;s Community News Network</description>
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		<title>By: hburgnews.com &#187; where the roots meet the road</title>
		<link>http://hburgnews.com/2007/10/05/trees-vs-signs/comment-page-1/#comment-27337</link>
		<dc:creator>hburgnews.com &#187; where the roots meet the road</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Feb 2008 19:15:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hburgnews.com/2007/10/05/trees-vs-signs/#comment-27337</guid>
		<description>[...] of Main Street downtown. That&#8217;s right; 23. I was thinking; why were the five relatively young trees in front of Cally&#8217;s spared, yet so many of these older trees are getting the [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] of Main Street downtown. That&#8217;s right; 23. I was thinking; why were the five relatively young trees in front of Cally&#8217;s spared, yet so many of these older trees are getting the [...]
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		<title>By: hburgnews &#187; Trees vs. Signs: Part II</title>
		<link>http://hburgnews.com/2007/10/05/trees-vs-signs/comment-page-1/#comment-15690</link>
		<dc:creator>hburgnews &#187; Trees vs. Signs: Part II</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Oct 2007 17:26:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hburgnews.com/2007/10/05/trees-vs-signs/#comment-15690</guid>
		<description>[...] the trees on Court Square that were causing all of the discussion about two weeks ago? The Harrisonburg City Council is going to decide what to do with them tonight. While this decision [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] the trees on Court Square that were causing all of the discussion about two weeks ago? The Harrisonburg City Council is going to decide what to do with them tonight. While this decision [...]
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		<title>By: republitarian</title>
		<link>http://hburgnews.com/2007/10/05/trees-vs-signs/comment-page-1/#comment-14659</link>
		<dc:creator>republitarian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Oct 2007 16:19:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hburgnews.com/2007/10/05/trees-vs-signs/#comment-14659</guid>
		<description>How bout if we go 50/50.... cut one down and leave the other.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>How bout if we go 50/50&#8230;. cut one down and leave the other.
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		<title>By: John M</title>
		<link>http://hburgnews.com/2007/10/05/trees-vs-signs/comment-page-1/#comment-14644</link>
		<dc:creator>John M</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Oct 2007 13:13:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hburgnews.com/2007/10/05/trees-vs-signs/#comment-14644</guid>
		<description>Benny, 

I wish it were that simple.  All of the tree experts I spoke with, and whose opinions I have read, say that the trees will be able to be trimmed in the future, but that they are too young to trim at this point.  The drastic “limbing” and trimming that would need to take place for the current signs to be visible would likely kill the trees.  If it didn&#039;t kill them they would be more prone to week limbs and other problems in the future.  Unfortunately everyone I spoke with gave me a different time frame for how long it will be before they can be &quot;limbed up&quot;, the shortest estimates I have heard are 5 years, the longest being 15. 

Everyone I spoke with also expressed opinions that these were excellent urban trees, and should be kept.  Kathy Holm, a member of the tree advisory committee, provided me with this quote regarding the trees:  

“The trees look remarkably healthy and are both younger and smaller than I had recalled.  I think that they contribute significantly to the impression that Court Square is a green space in the heart of downtown.   I would not say that the building they front and partially conceal is architecturally noteworthy.  The trees currently distance the building and its entrance from the street edge.  Were the two trees nearest the entrance removed, I fear that the entrance would seem closer to the street – uncomfortably so.”  - Arthur Bartenstein, landscape architect with Frazier Associates

To learn more about them follow this link:

http://hort.ufl.edu/trees/ZELSERC.pdf    

(Notice that section under trunk and branches, it is my understanding that breakage and weaker wood is much more common in trees that are not pruned properly, i.e too early.)

After reading about their characteristics I&#039;m really considering planting at least one in my backyard.  Lots of shade, fast growth, resistant to pests, no fruit or nuts to contend with when mowing the lawn...

I hope that answered your question Benny, sorry about the length of my response.

John</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Benny, </p>
<p>I wish it were that simple.  All of the tree experts I spoke with, and whose opinions I have read, say that the trees will be able to be trimmed in the future, but that they are too young to trim at this point.  The drastic “limbing” and trimming that would need to take place for the current signs to be visible would likely kill the trees.  If it didn&#8217;t kill them they would be more prone to week limbs and other problems in the future.  Unfortunately everyone I spoke with gave me a different time frame for how long it will be before they can be &#8220;limbed up&#8221;, the shortest estimates I have heard are 5 years, the longest being 15. </p>
<p>Everyone I spoke with also expressed opinions that these were excellent urban trees, and should be kept.  Kathy Holm, a member of the tree advisory committee, provided me with this quote regarding the trees:  </p>
<p>“The trees look remarkably healthy and are both younger and smaller than I had recalled.  I think that they contribute significantly to the impression that Court Square is a green space in the heart of downtown.   I would not say that the building they front and partially conceal is architecturally noteworthy.  The trees currently distance the building and its entrance from the street edge.  Were the two trees nearest the entrance removed, I fear that the entrance would seem closer to the street – uncomfortably so.”  &#8211; Arthur Bartenstein, landscape architect with Frazier Associates</p>
<p>To learn more about them follow this link:</p>
<p><a href="http://hort.ufl.edu/trees/ZELSERC.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://hort.ufl.edu/trees/ZELSERC.pdf</a>    </p>
<p>(Notice that section under trunk and branches, it is my understanding that breakage and weaker wood is much more common in trees that are not pruned properly, i.e too early.)</p>
<p>After reading about their characteristics I&#8217;m really considering planting at least one in my backyard.  Lots of shade, fast growth, resistant to pests, no fruit or nuts to contend with when mowing the lawn&#8230;</p>
<p>I hope that answered your question Benny, sorry about the length of my response.</p>
<p>John
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		<title>By: Benny Neal</title>
		<link>http://hburgnews.com/2007/10/05/trees-vs-signs/comment-page-1/#comment-14641</link>
		<dc:creator>Benny Neal</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Oct 2007 12:38:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hburgnews.com/2007/10/05/trees-vs-signs/#comment-14641</guid>
		<description>...Could&#039;nt the city just trim the trees and leave them there? That would be a compromise.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8230;Could&#8217;nt the city just trim the trees and leave them there? That would be a compromise.
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		<title>By: Thanh</title>
		<link>http://hburgnews.com/2007/10/05/trees-vs-signs/comment-page-1/#comment-14637</link>
		<dc:creator>Thanh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Oct 2007 11:32:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hburgnews.com/2007/10/05/trees-vs-signs/#comment-14637</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;There is a lot of evidence out there that says trees are good for good for downtown areas, gives people a sense of belonging, good for businesses because people value neighborhoods and business districts with trees (the neighborhood looks like its being taken care of), is good for the environment (stormwater management, energy savings by shade and wind breaking, air quality)... I could go on. Here are a few links to some studies and factsheets that may be of interest. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;- Trees: A Prospectus, A Solid Green Investment - http://www.urbanforestcoalition.com/doc/NTT_Retrospective_FinalWeb.pdf&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;- Trees in Business Districts: Comparing Values of Consumers and Business - http://www.cfr.washington.edu/research.envmind/CityBiz/BizPrefs-FS4.pdf&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;- Business Districts, Streetscapes, Trees and Consumer Response - http://www.cfr.washington.edu/research.envmind/CityBiz/BizTreesAll_JFor.pdf&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;- The Value of the Urban Forest - http://www.cnr.vt.edu/urbanforestry/Posters/2006-Virginia%20Forests-62(1)10-14.pdf&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I personally love all the trees downtown, and I hope that the coming streetscape projects preserves the existing trees. As a bicyclist and a frequent pedestrian to various places of business, I find myself spending more time outside browsing shops, sitting down to enjoy a coffee, where there are trees. Just thought I&#039;d share.&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There is a lot of evidence out there that says trees are good for good for downtown areas, gives people a sense of belonging, good for businesses because people value neighborhoods and business districts with trees (the neighborhood looks like its being taken care of), is good for the environment (stormwater management, energy savings by shade and wind breaking, air quality)&#8230; I could go on. Here are a few links to some studies and factsheets that may be of interest. </p>
<p>- Trees: A Prospectus, A Solid Green Investment &#8211; <a href="http://www.urbanforestcoalition.com/doc/NTT_Retrospective_FinalWeb.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://www.urbanforestcoalition.com/doc/NTT_Retrospective_FinalWeb.pdf</a></p>
<p>- Trees in Business Districts: Comparing Values of Consumers and Business &#8211; <a href="http://www.cfr.washington.edu/research.envmind/CityBiz/BizPrefs-FS4.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://www.cfr.washington.edu/research.envmind/CityBiz/BizPrefs-FS4.pdf</a></p>
<p>- Business Districts, Streetscapes, Trees and Consumer Response &#8211; <a href="http://www.cfr.washington.edu/research.envmind/CityBiz/BizTreesAll_JFor.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://www.cfr.washington.edu/research.envmind/CityBiz/BizTreesAll_JFor.pdf</a></p>
<p>- The Value of the Urban Forest &#8211; <a href="http://www.cnr.vt.edu/urbanforestry/Posters/2006-Virginia%20Forests-62(1)10-14.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://www.cnr.vt.edu/urbanforestry/Posters/2006-Virginia%20Forests-62(1)10-14.pdf</a></p>
<p>I personally love all the trees downtown, and I hope that the coming streetscape projects preserves the existing trees. As a bicyclist and a frequent pedestrian to various places of business, I find myself spending more time outside browsing shops, sitting down to enjoy a coffee, where there are trees. Just thought I&#8217;d share.</p>
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		<title>By: David Troyer</title>
		<link>http://hburgnews.com/2007/10/05/trees-vs-signs/comment-page-1/#comment-14588</link>
		<dc:creator>David Troyer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Oct 2007 22:13:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hburgnews.com/2007/10/05/trees-vs-signs/#comment-14588</guid>
		<description>I really hope this doesn&#039;t get messy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I really hope this doesn&#8217;t get messy.
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		<title>By: John M</title>
		<link>http://hburgnews.com/2007/10/05/trees-vs-signs/comment-page-1/#comment-14580</link>
		<dc:creator>John M</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Oct 2007 20:40:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hburgnews.com/2007/10/05/trees-vs-signs/#comment-14580</guid>
		<description>Hello,
 
I just wanted to give everyone a heads up about the Court Square Trees issue.  Last night the council members decided to &quot;table&quot; the tree removal until next council meeting (two weeks).  They also formed a committee made up of Councilman Chenault, Kurt Hodgen - City Manager, Stacy Turner - Director Planning and Community Development (Member of the Tree Board), Eddie Bumbaugh - Downtown Renaissance, and representatives from each of the three businesses.  The goal of the committee is to find an alternative to tree relocation.  After two weeks the committee must return to council with some kind of solution to this issue.  Charlie Chenault stated that he was going to save the trees, so I am fairly confident that they are going to stay put.  However, that is not set in stone, and things can change.  If this committee can&#039;t find an acceptable alternative the trees may still be removed.  
 
Thus, in the next two weeks there is still quite a bit of planning and things to do regarding this issue.  First and foremost, the committee is looking for ideas.  If anyone has any ideas regarding alternative signage please send them to Mr. Chenault, or if you prefer you can send them to me, and I&#039;ll make sure they get to the right place. 
 
Also, if anyone knows a sign company that may be up for some free publicity in return for some discounted signs definitely pass that on as well.  
 
Thanks for all of you help, I&#039;ll try to keep you all updated as best I can.
 
John
savehburgtrees at gmail dot com</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hello,</p>
<p>I just wanted to give everyone a heads up about the Court Square Trees issue.  Last night the council members decided to &#8220;table&#8221; the tree removal until next council meeting (two weeks).  They also formed a committee made up of Councilman Chenault, Kurt Hodgen &#8211; City Manager, Stacy Turner &#8211; Director Planning and Community Development (Member of the Tree Board), Eddie Bumbaugh &#8211; Downtown Renaissance, and representatives from each of the three businesses.  The goal of the committee is to find an alternative to tree relocation.  After two weeks the committee must return to council with some kind of solution to this issue.  Charlie Chenault stated that he was going to save the trees, so I am fairly confident that they are going to stay put.  However, that is not set in stone, and things can change.  If this committee can&#8217;t find an acceptable alternative the trees may still be removed.  </p>
<p>Thus, in the next two weeks there is still quite a bit of planning and things to do regarding this issue.  First and foremost, the committee is looking for ideas.  If anyone has any ideas regarding alternative signage please send them to Mr. Chenault, or if you prefer you can send them to me, and I&#8217;ll make sure they get to the right place. </p>
<p>Also, if anyone knows a sign company that may be up for some free publicity in return for some discounted signs definitely pass that on as well.  </p>
<p>Thanks for all of you help, I&#8217;ll try to keep you all updated as best I can.</p>
<p>John<br />
savehburgtrees at gmail dot com
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		<title>By: John M</title>
		<link>http://hburgnews.com/2007/10/05/trees-vs-signs/comment-page-1/#comment-14477</link>
		<dc:creator>John M</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Oct 2007 16:33:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hburgnews.com/2007/10/05/trees-vs-signs/#comment-14477</guid>
		<description>Finnegan,

That&#039;s the building.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Finnegan,</p>
<p>That&#8217;s the building.
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